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Solar Questions

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Rana View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rana Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Solar Questions
    Posted: 12 Mar 2022 at 12:43pm
Thanks so much Offgrid, for taking the time to respond in so much detail, you have given me much to think about, and I'll have to brush up my math skills to do some measurements and calculations. I have two amp meters, a DC one and an AC one, not sure how accurate they are, but I have a friend who is an electrician and he may be able to check them for me. The weather is improving slowly, and so I should be able to get to grips with this in a few weeks hopefully. I collect the 2 x 6v  batteries from the service shop next week.
Thanks again.
Rana
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Post Options Post Options   Quote offgrid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Mar 2022 at 3:08am
Do the calculation in amps and amp hours, not watts and watt hours. That is because there are lots of power losses in the system, so you will underestimate if you use watts unless you keep track of those. There aren't really any significant current losses so that approach works better and simpler. Also batteries are rated in amp hours.

Separate your loads into AC and DC. If it is a 12V DC load use or measure the current draw. A clamp on DC multimeter is handy for these measurements. Under $40 on Amazon and well worth having in your travelling toolkit.

Multiply the current by the hours or fractions of hours per day you are running that load to get amp hours. Loads like the water pump really only run a few minutes in a while day so no need to overestimate.

If it is an AC load convert it to DC amps at 12V as follows

AC watts X 10/.85 = DC amps.

The X 10 multiplier is to convert from 120V to 12V. The .85 is an approximation of the inverter conversion efficiency.

As you can see even a small AC load takes a large amount of energy to operate, so avoid AC loads as much as possible. Once you have the DC amps to the inverter needed to run each AC load multiply by the hours or fractions of hours to get DC amp hours, same as with the DC loads.

Add up all the calculated amp hour loads to get total daily amp hours.

If you want to be able to run from your batteries for one day, multiply by 2 and get batteries of at leasr that capacity. The 2x multiplier is to limit the max depth of discharge of the battery to 50%, which is the most you will want to pull out of a lead acid battery if you want it to last. If you want to go 2 days without recharging then double that.


If you want to run on solar for long periods you might want even more battery capacity in case you run into a few cloudy days or you're camped under a tree canopy, but you will find that the battery size gets excessive quickly if you are trying to run a lot of gear and appliances. Better to bring a generator for those situations.

You could also consider converting to lithium batteries but that is another discussion.

To determine how much solar you need, start by calculating the size needed to maintain your battery on an average day in your area/time of year you are camping For summer use in the west with a portable solar module tilted south you can expect about 5 hours of full sun daily. In the east around 4. If you are roof mounting the solar modules horizontally then assume around 4 and 3 hours respectively. If you plan on camping into the late fall then solar performance starts dropping pretty quickly, especially for a horizonal roof mount.

To calculate solar module size you can use this formula

load amp hours per day / sun hours per day × 12 × 1.5 equals watts of solar.

The 1.5 takes into account system losses and an adjustment for the way solar modules are tested and rated, the discussion of which I won't bore you with here.

Sizing your battery and solar module to you loads this way works fine for most folks, just be sure to have an alternate charging source if you boondock for long periods in areas that get cloudy weather.

Don't forget to get a solar charge controller and install properly sized wire with a fuse at the battery + terminal to protect the solar charge circuit. If you get a standard solar module designed for 12V battery operation a simple PWM charge controller will be fine.

Wiring and fusing should be sized for current at least 50% higher than the max short circuit rating of the solar module to handle peak output from cloud reflections and avoid nuisance fuse blows. That is 20A for 12 gauge, 30A for 10 gauge, 40 for 8 gauge. If you're using a portable module with long cables go at least one size larger yet to limit voltage drops.





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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rana Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 2022 at 4:53pm
Thanks so much. That's god advice. We don't really have that many electrical consumers on board, a Nespresso coffee machine, and a small microwave. I will add those up, add what we have already calculated for battery charging,  and estimate the daily requirements, and see where that goes. My next challenge is to install a double USB charging outlet somewhere near the stereo and TV, and have seen a few posts about that. Hopefully the snow will be gone soon and it will warm up, and we can start going on some trips! Thanks again.
Rana
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Mooree Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Mar 2022 at 5:01am
To upgrade a solar RV requires a certain amount of solar energy. I use the appliance energy approach to determine my RV's solar requirements and see how much solar I need for my RV? All electrical equipment has an energy rating expressed in watts and amps. You'll want to check each device's watt-hour rating and list them down. Next, it is important to determine how many hours you plan to operate each piece of equipment. Multiply each appliance's wattage rating by the number of hours the device will be in use.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rana Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jun 2021 at 4:33pm
Thanks so much offgrid and JR, your advice was spot on, I followed it to the letter and now have a functioning solar charging system. We have a suitcase two panel system that came with a controller and the appropriate connector and correctly sized wiring. Thanks again, your expertise saved me from making a costly mistake.

Rana.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 May 2021 at 6:54pm
+1 to offgrids instructions.  If you have purchased a solar panel portable system referred to as a suitcase, because it folds up like a suitcase, it should already have a charge controller included in the equipment.  The charge controller is normally mounted on the back of one of the solar panels.  If you have assembled all the parts of the system yourself you do need to have a charge controller in the system.  The other thing to be careful of is when you are using the Zamp wiring included on the trailer make sure the positive from the solar panels is actually going to the positive battery terminal.  When you use different manufactures for different parts of your solar system the wiring (+ & -) may not be compatible or wired the same.  Hope this helps and have fun. 
Jay

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Post Options Post Options   Quote offgrid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 May 2021 at 5:54pm
Yes you will need a charge controller for your solar module. That will go in between the solar and the battery. You can mount it either on the solar module or near the battery. Once you have the solar connected up and operating and have reconnected the trailer wires you can leave them connected. You can leave the solar connected too and unplug it when you want to move camp, then plug in again when you set up camp.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rana Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 May 2021 at 4:57pm
Thanks for the speedy reply, especially at the weekend, very much appreciated!
I'll do as you suggest about the disconnection of the two main wires, and then connect the solar wires, and then reconnect the main wires. 
I am presuming that the main wires can stay connected until the battery charging is complete and I take the solar wires off, or pull out the plug at the rear?? 
There is no mention of a charging controller in my package that came with the portable panels, will I need to get one?
Thanks so much, again,
Rana
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Post Options Post Options   Quote offgrid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 May 2021 at 4:45pm
Rana, yes the two wires should only go to the zamp connector, unless of course someone has made a modification to the trailer at done point.

I would disconnect the two larger wires which go to the chassis (negative) and to the fuse box (positive) while working on getting the solar connected. Disconnect the negative first, it prevents accidentally shorting your tools to the rpod chassis when you disconnect the positive. After the solar is connected reconnect the two larger wires in the reverse order, pos first, then neg.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rana Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 May 2021 at 4:25pm
Hi Offgrid,

I have the zamp connection at the back of my 2015 RP179, and two taped cables up at the batteries marked "Solar". We have two 6v golf cart batteries installed. 
I gather from your earlier reply that the two "Solar" cables up front only go back to the zamp connector at the rear and no where else?
I note your suggestion about connecting directly at the batteries, but, when connecting the "Solar" wires to the battery for solar charging do I have to disconnect the two wires that are already connected to the batteries and go back into the chassis, presumably to the Electrical distribution box? 
As you recommended I can get an inline fuse to fix to the zamp cable positive line at the battery end.
Thanks so much for your time,

Stay well and stay healthy,

Rana.
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