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offgrid View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Newbie looking at purchase and vehicles
    Posted: 16 Mar 2021 at 7:06pm
Looks like such energy recovery systems are available, but they use ultracaps not batteries. Capacitors are probably a better option, there’s not that much energy involved, but the short term power flow is relatively high.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Mar 2021 at 4:33pm
If I recall correctly, though it's been a while since I retired, the car weighs 60% of the weight of the counterweights.  It's balanced when the car's full, but it is a little less so when traveling up and down relatively empty.  It's too bad they couldn't have used those extra electrons to charge some batteries.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Mar 2021 at 4:01pm
I think the reason a light bulb would work for an elevator is because the weights are pretty well balanced so there is very little energy wasted either going up or down.

I ran the numbers and one of our rigs weighing around 9000 lbs is going to produce around 10kwh of energy going down a 3000 ft mountain. A practical EV that could tow a trailer a reasonable distance would need around 200 kWh of batteries anyway so that’s only 5% of battery capacity. Pretty easy just to only charge to 90-95% to have enough headroom.

Assuming 60 mph on a typical 6% freeway grade you would take 10 minutes to make that descent so you would need a 60kw light bulb or car heater if you did it that way. You would either be blinded or cooked alive I think

OTOH all the new EV trucks will have upwards of 400-500 hp (300-400 kw) motor/generators so no problem for them to suck up 60kw.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Mar 2021 at 10:42am
Originally posted by lostagain

Maybe electric vehicles can install a giant search light pointing up on the roof of the car to burn off that excess energy from driving down hill.  Confused

Or maybe add an electric heater for the cabin to dump excess energy to? (might be a problem in the summer... Hrmmm)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Mar 2021 at 7:58am
I assume the the starter is the conventional ring gear system that most internal combustion engines have, but maybe they hid squirrels in there.  I really don't know.

In regard to regenerative braking, in old motor/generator elevators they used to burn a lightbulb to deal with the energy captured in the ascent of the elevator.  [Contrary to popular belief, the descent is what uses the most energy because the counterweights have to be lifted and they're really heavy.]  Maybe electric vehicles can install a giant search light pointing up on the roof of the car to burn off that excess energy from driving down hill.  Confused
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Mar 2021 at 6:33am
LA, does the 2.7 EB starter have conventional ring gear engagement? Still wondering about that report the hybrid has a belt starter. Doesn’t make much sense to my why a hybrid would need a starter at all.

GG, you can’t depend on regen braking to replace engine braking on a hybrid, the battery is too small (1.5kwh on the F150) and so is the motor/generator (35kw). Also the battery might already be fully charged when you hit the downhill grade. The Prius shifter has a “B” mode which creates engine braking for this purpose.

Even pure EV’s can have that problem. There are folks with EVs who live on top of mountains who configure their home charging profile so that there’s “room” in the battery to recover the potential energy when they head downhill. But what if you happen to be fully charged at the top of a long grade? Since EVs have no engine braking if the battery is full they are completely dependent on their friction brakes. That could be a problem although I haven’t heard of issues yet, but there aren’t many folks hauling heavy loads in EVs yet. I suppose it could be solved the way it’s done on diesel/electric locomotives, by dynamic braking where the excess energy is dissipated in a big resistor bank. If EVs had something like that they could probably eventually eliminate friction brakes entirely. As it is most ev drivers do almost all one pedal driving (no friction braking) anyhow.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Mar 2021 at 2:23pm
Our F-150 turns off and on at stops in traffic, such as a traffic light.  It is so quiet in that fuel saving feature that we hardly notice it when it turns off or starts up again.  
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Mar 2021 at 1:21pm
Our 2015 has a 3.31 rear axle ratio, and with the 6-speed tranny it is not an issue at all. The engine loafs along at 1500 RPM when we're cruising at 60 MPH, and the engine is super quiet. The only thing I have against it is the engine braking is not quite strong enough. It has not been a problem for us, even in the mountains (it has really large disc brakes all around). However, from what I've read, the hybrid F150 recharges the big battery mainly through regenerative braking, so I suspect that would help in the downhill department. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Mar 2021 at 4:46am
The difference between having a power inverter on a conventional ICE and having one on a hybrid is a big one. On a hybrid the inverter can operate from the battery pack allowing the ICE to cycle on an off as needed, reducing noise, fuel use, and wear and tear. On the conventional drivetrain the engine has to run continuously.

For example if I leave my Prius on with it’s a/c (which is electric not belt driven) running the engine cycles on and off but the a/c continues to run. I’ve used that feature often to keep my dogs from overheating while parked at a store or restaurant. Much better than having to leave your engine idle for long periods, at least for me.

The article I read on the Ford Pro Power inverter is that it does run from the high voltage hybrid battery pack and will allow the ICE to cycle off at output levels below 2.4kw.(there are 120V 2.4kw and a 240V 7.2 kw versions). For loads above that the engine stays on. But 2.4kw ought to be fine for an RPod, although you might still need an Easystart on the a/c to keep its startup load low enough that the ICE doesn’t startup every time the a/c compressor starts. One of the things it would be interesting to find out.

Another is just how noisy is the engine operating cycle in the F150 hybrid. In a Prius you barely notice the engine starting and operating (the big electric motor kicks it on instantly, there is no conventional starter and ring gear engagement noise) so if the F150 Hybrid is similarly quiet so could avoid annoying your camping neighbors and running afoul of campground quiet hour rules. Apparently the F150 hybrid still has a starter motor which is on a belt drive, which seems weird and unnecessary considering there is a 35kw motor in there but might be fine. Some of this kind of stuff you just have to see and hear for yourself.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Mar 2021 at 6:07pm
Neptune1 - I wouldn't be as concerned about gear ratio as I would tow capacity.  For years gear ratio has had a direct effect on tow capacity, however OG is right, these new trans with tow options and mulitiple gears have nearly eliminated rear end gear ratio as a factor. The OEMs will use a standard gear.  If your TV was a 1972 Ford Ranger F150 with  a 4 speed and a 360 motor, that rear end might be a option.  Now days find a capable tow capacity.

BTW - the power converter is an option on Fords other than Hybrids.  My understanding is it is standard on Hybrids.
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