Fresh water tank leaking - R-pod Owners Forum

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crw8sr

Senior Member

Joined: 12 Oct 2017
Location: Omaha Nebraska
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Posts: 328

Topic: Fresh water tank leaking
Posted: 09 Jun 2020 at 5:19pm

Sounds like you nailed it. Good luck on the repair. Keep us updated.

Chuck & Lyn
Izzy, Morkie. RIP
Zoe Joy & Gracie, Yorkie
2018 R Pod 190
2019 Traverse

In moments of adversity;when life's a total wreck, I think of those worse off than me and really feel like heck.

Prestone

Newbie

Joined: 26 Jul 2019
Location: Conroe, TX
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 14

Posted: 09 Jun 2020 at 10:06am

So I finally got around to attempting a fix for the leak around the fresh water drain flange. Thanks for the discussion here, I would have slapped some silicon on there without all of the thoughts you all provided. The flange area is an obvious weak point so I didn’t want to spend big bucks on a fix considering the future likelihood for failure.

I decided to go with JB WaterWeld for three reasons...1) it’s drinking water safe, 2) it’s low cost ~$5, 3) application fits my skill set as a DIYer.

What’s the worst that could happen?.. I can always buy a new tank.

Here’s what I did. Cranking the tongue all the way up gave me enough room to slide under. Then I drilled stop holes on either end of the crack to prevent spreading. Next I took a drywall saw and sawed along the crack to increase the width (gap) careful to only cut on the pull stroke to prevent getting plastic shards in the tank. The idea was to create a small gap that the putty could fill instead of just spreading it on the surface. Finally I pushed the putty into the crack and spread it around the area a bit to get full coverage and applied a little upward pressure with a reversed quick clamp to keep alignment between the sides of the cracks as it was sagging a bit before.

So far so good, it held water overnight. We’ll see what effect time and usage have.

In the pics below you can see the crack with drilled holes, the texture of the putty and the clamping arrangement.

Prestone

Newbie

Joined: 26 Jul 2019
Location: Conroe, TX
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 14

Posted: 01 Feb 2020 at 11:38am

I’ve been traveling for the last couple of weeks so I haven’t done anything yet. Good call on the drilling, I’ll have to read back through these posts when I’m ready to attempt a fix.

offgrid

Senior Member

Joined: 23 Jul 2018
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Posts: 5290

Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 8:31am

One more thing I just rembered, if you haven’t done the repair yet. Stop drill any crack(s) first, otherwise they will almost certainly just continue to propagate.

1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold

offgrid

Senior Member

Joined: 23 Jul 2018
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5290

Posted: 10 Jan 2020 at 3:11pm

The TAP site states a lap shear adhesion of 2000 psi on flame treated HDPE. The West Systems site states a tensile adhesion of around the same number on the same material, also flame treated. But there is a difference between the two tests, the TAP one is done pulling on a lap joint so is measuring resistance to shear, while the West System one is a pull test perpendicular to the glued joint, putting tension on it. I’m quite sure the tension test is more difficult than the shear test, so if it were me I’d stick with the gFlex. Either way though, flame treatment is in order.

1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold

lostagain

Senior Member

Joined: 06 Sep 2016
Location: Quaker Hill, CT
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2595

Posted: 10 Jan 2020 at 12:48pm

TAP provides the adhesion technical data too: https://www.tapplastics.com/uploads/pdf/Tech%20Data-2011-%20Poly-Weld.pdf

I should have looked at the West System site since it didn't show up on the Google search. I've been using West System products for more than 40 years and they are very reliable. Looks like either the TAP or the West g flex products would be good choices. But, the West Systems data doesn't say wether it can be used to repair food/water containers for human consumption as is cautioned about by TAP in their video. Bottom line, if you repair your fresh water tank with any product that is not certified for food/water containers, it might be best to test the water safety on Fido or someone else's children first.

Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost

offgrid

Senior Member

Joined: 23 Jul 2018
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5290

Posted: 10 Jan 2020 at 10:56am

The West Systems gflex tech specs give specific adhesion strength data for polyethylene with and without flame treatment. I don’t know why anyone would use a product that doesn’t specifically provide that data when there is at least one that does.

Regardless of what adhesive is used, do flame treat the area first. That is really easy, all you do is wave a propane torch over the area first. Polyethylene is a low surface energy plastic which is what you want for a fresh water tank, so gunk doesn’t stick to it. The flame treatment temporarily activates the polyethylene surface so stuff can stick.

1994 Chinook Concourse
1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft
2015 Rpod 179 - sold

lostagain

Senior Member

Joined: 06 Sep 2016
Location: Quaker Hill, CT
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2595

Posted: 10 Jan 2020 at 9:55am

Googling the issue brought up several possible solutions:

TAP plastics has an adhesive they claim works well, but they note it hasn't yet been approved for food/water containers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-9yhanz5DE

These folks also claim to have a fast bond material for polyethylene: https://tbbonding.com/glue-polyethylene/

Of course, Amazon always has something: https://www.amazon.com/Technicqll-Adhesive-Polypropylene-Polyethylene-Silicone/dp/B006U49M3G

And a Google User Group has an thread on this issue: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.woodworking/uuss6b0W6sI

I have not tried any of these methods, but it looks like they may be worth looking into. The TAP product looks like the best for holes or cuts in polyethylene tanks, but for until they designate it food safe, it may be best to use it only on waste tanks or you might be growing a new appendage or some other exotic new body part. Indeed, with all of suggestions in this thread, it may be well worth looking into the food use safety issue.

Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost

Prestone

Newbie

Joined: 26 Jul 2019
Location: Conroe, TX
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 14

Posted: 10 Jan 2020 at 7:40am

JB makes an epoxy putty called WaterWeld as well. It says it’s good for portable water tanks (many of which are made of polyethylene) but doesn’t specify whether it’ll work on polyethylene or not. I like the putty for ease of use in this application. I’ll get under there to take a better look at the crack this weekend before I decide.

mcarter

podders Helping podders - pHp

Joined: 07 Apr 2016
Location: Greenbrier, TN
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 3419

Posted: 09 Jan 2020 at 6:39pm

I like the JB products, used them for years. Choosing the right one is important.

Mike Carter
2015 178
" I had the right to remain silent, I just didn't have the ability."

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crw8sr Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 12 Oct 2017 Location: Omaha Nebraska Online Status: Offline Posts: 328	Topic: Fresh water tank leaking Posted: 09 Jun 2020 at 5:19pm
	Sounds like you nailed it. Good luck on the repair. Keep us updated.
	Chuck & Lyn Izzy, Morkie. RIP Zoe Joy & Gracie, Yorkie 2018 R Pod 190 2019 Traverse In moments of adversity;when life's a total wreck, I think of those worse off than me and really feel like heck.

Prestone Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Newbie Joined: 26 Jul 2019 Location: Conroe, TX Online Status: Offline Posts: 14	Posted: 09 Jun 2020 at 10:06am
	So I finally got around to attempting a fix for the leak around the fresh water drain flange. Thanks for the discussion here, I would have slapped some silicon on there without all of the thoughts you all provided. The flange area is an obvious weak point so I didn’t want to spend big bucks on a fix considering the future likelihood for failure. I decided to go with JB WaterWeld for three reasons...1) it’s drinking water safe, 2) it’s low cost ~$5, 3) application fits my skill set as a DIYer. What’s the worst that could happen?.. I can always buy a new tank. Here’s what I did. Cranking the tongue all the way up gave me enough room to slide under. Then I drilled stop holes on either end of the crack to prevent spreading. Next I took a drywall saw and sawed along the crack to increase the width (gap) careful to only cut on the pull stroke to prevent getting plastic shards in the tank. The idea was to create a small gap that the putty could fill instead of just spreading it on the surface. Finally I pushed the putty into the crack and spread it around the area a bit to get full coverage and applied a little upward pressure with a reversed quick clamp to keep alignment between the sides of the cracks as it was sagging a bit before. So far so good, it held water overnight. We’ll see what effect time and usage have. In the pics below you can see the crack with drilled holes, the texture of the putty and the clamping arrangement.

Prestone Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Newbie Joined: 26 Jul 2019 Location: Conroe, TX Online Status: Offline Posts: 14	Posted: 01 Feb 2020 at 11:38am
	I’ve been traveling for the last couple of weeks so I haven’t done anything yet. Good call on the drilling, I’ll have to read back through these posts when I’m ready to attempt a fix.

offgrid Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 23 Jul 2018 Online Status: Offline Posts: 5290	Posted: 16 Jan 2020 at 8:31am
	One more thing I just rembered, if you haven’t done the repair yet. Stop drill any crack(s) first, otherwise they will almost certainly just continue to propagate.
	1994 Chinook Concourse 1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft 2015 Rpod 179 - sold

offgrid Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 23 Jul 2018 Online Status: Offline Posts: 5290	Posted: 10 Jan 2020 at 3:11pm
	The TAP site states a lap shear adhesion of 2000 psi on flame treated HDPE. The West Systems site states a tensile adhesion of around the same number on the same material, also flame treated. But there is a difference between the two tests, the TAP one is done pulling on a lap joint so is measuring resistance to shear, while the West System one is a pull test perpendicular to the glued joint, putting tension on it. I’m quite sure the tension test is more difficult than the shear test, so if it were me I’d stick with the gFlex. Either way though, flame treatment is in order.
	1994 Chinook Concourse 1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft 2015 Rpod 179 - sold

lostagain Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 06 Sep 2016 Location: Quaker Hill, CT Online Status: Offline Posts: 2595	Posted: 10 Jan 2020 at 12:48pm
	TAP provides the adhesion technical data too: https://www.tapplastics.com/uploads/pdf/Tech%20Data-2011-%20Poly-Weld.pdf I should have looked at the West System site since it didn't show up on the Google search. I've been using West System products for more than 40 years and they are very reliable. Looks like either the TAP or the West g flex products would be good choices. But, the West Systems data doesn't say wether it can be used to repair food/water containers for human consumption as is cautioned about by TAP in their video. Bottom line, if you repair your fresh water tank with any product that is not certified for food/water containers, it might be best to test the water safety on Fido or someone else's children first.
	Never leave footprints behind. Fred & Maria Kearney Sonoma 167RB Our Pod 172 2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost

offgrid Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 23 Jul 2018 Online Status: Offline Posts: 5290	Posted: 10 Jan 2020 at 10:56am
	The West Systems gflex tech specs give specific adhesion strength data for polyethylene with and without flame treatment. I don’t know why anyone would use a product that doesn’t specifically provide that data when there is at least one that does. Regardless of what adhesive is used, do flame treat the area first. That is really easy, all you do is wave a propane torch over the area first. Polyethylene is a low surface energy plastic which is what you want for a fresh water tank, so gunk doesn’t stick to it. The flame treatment temporarily activates the polyethylene surface so stuff can stick.
	1994 Chinook Concourse 1995 RV6A Experimental Aircraft 2015 Rpod 179 - sold

lostagain Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Senior Member Joined: 06 Sep 2016 Location: Quaker Hill, CT Online Status: Offline Posts: 2595	Posted: 10 Jan 2020 at 9:55am
	Googling the issue brought up several possible solutions: TAP plastics has an adhesive they claim works well, but they note it hasn't yet been approved for food/water containers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-9yhanz5DE These folks also claim to have a fast bond material for polyethylene: https://tbbonding.com/glue-polyethylene/ Of course, Amazon always has something: https://www.amazon.com/Technicqll-Adhesive-Polypropylene-Polyethylene-Silicone/dp/B006U49M3G And a Google User Group has an thread on this issue: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/rec.woodworking/uuss6b0W6sI I have not tried any of these methods, but it looks like they may be worth looking into. The TAP product looks like the best for holes or cuts in polyethylene tanks, but for until they designate it food safe, it may be best to use it only on waste tanks or you might be growing a new appendage or some other exotic new body part. Indeed, with all of suggestions in this thread, it may be well worth looking into the food use safety issue.
	Never leave footprints behind. Fred & Maria Kearney Sonoma 167RB Our Pod 172 2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost

Prestone Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Newbie Joined: 26 Jul 2019 Location: Conroe, TX Online Status: Offline Posts: 14	Posted: 10 Jan 2020 at 7:40am
	JB makes an epoxy putty called WaterWeld as well. It says it’s good for portable water tanks (many of which are made of polyethylene) but doesn’t specify whether it’ll work on polyethylene or not. I like the putty for ease of use in this application. I’ll get under there to take a better look at the crack this weekend before I decide.

mcarter Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List podders Helping podders - pHp Joined: 07 Apr 2016 Location: Greenbrier, TN Online Status: Offline Posts: 3419	Posted: 09 Jan 2020 at 6:39pm
	I like the JB products, used them for years. Choosing the right one is important.
	Mike Carter 2015 178 " I had the right to remain silent, I just didn't have the ability."