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WDH yes or no?

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Topic: WDH yes or no?
Posted By: Yedmonds5
Subject: WDH yes or no?
Date Posted: 22 Apr 2023 at 7:25pm
Hi, I just bought a used 2012 Rpod 176, my tow vehicle is a VW Atlas cross sport V6. I’m not sure if I need a WDH? What does everyone else have for their hitch? Also, do you all have a brake controller as well as a WDH? Your help and advice would be appreciated.
Happy Camping 😉



Replies:
Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 22 Apr 2023 at 8:04pm
Hello and welcome! Congratulations on your new-to-you RPod. I hope you have many fun adventures with it and make many great memories doing so.

Now, a brake controller is not optional. You do need one. California requires trailer brakes on trailers over 1500 lbs from what I have seen with a quick look-up. Those brakes need to operate so if the VW does not come with an integrated brake controller, you will need to purchase and install one or have one installed for you. I like the Hopkins In-SIGHT controller, but they may be discontinued. I liked it because it had the main unit under the dash out of the way and had separate manual control and display that could be positioned so they made it easy to see and actuate. Is your Atlas equipped with a hitch receiver? Does it have a 7-way trailer connector? If it does not have either, you will need them installed. If it has the hitch but only a 4-way trailer connector, you will need to run wiring to connect a brake controller unless you go with one of the wireless units. I have not experience with the wireless ones so someone else would need to comment on that possibility. We recently changed to a Ford F-150 with integrated controller so my Hopkins unit is available for much less than this:   https://amazon.com/Hopkins-47297-INSIGHT-Simple-Control/dp/B00C5THYIK - https://amazon.com/Hopkins-47297-INSIGHT-Simple-Control/dp/B00C5THYIK

As for a WDH, there are multiple considerations. First is whether your Atlas is FWD or AWD. If it is FWD, you definitely need a WDH to transfer weight back to the front axle. Otherwise, you will have problems starting on slopes, wet roads, or dirt/gravel since the trailer will push down the back end and lift the front end. You would still have problems with steering even if it is AWD due to the weight shift. A WDH helps. What is just as important is to get one with sway control also. Trust me, you don't want to have to deal with sway so having the proper 10-15% of the trailer's weight as tongue weight is critical. Too much toward the back and it can make sway much more likely.

https://towstats.com/vw-atlas-towing-capacity/ - https://towstats.com/vw-atlas-towing-capacity/

I like this site's recommendation to check with your dealer to verify the tow capacity.


-------------
StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: Yedmonds5
Date Posted: 22 Apr 2023 at 10:52pm
Thank you @StephenH.  Yes, my car came equipped with the trailer hitch and a 7 pin connector, the towing capacity is up to 5000lbs and it is AWD 4matic. It does not have the brake controller and I have been wondering about the WDH.  Thank you for the recommendations, so glad I found this site.  I will look at the controller you recommended.  
What do you think of the Blue Ox WDH? 


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2023 at 6:09am
Welcome to the board Yedmonds5.  Hope you find lots of useful information.  The archives are full of content that can help you.  When you search be sure to expand the date range for year or two back, or more, for discussion on all your questions. 

I agree with StephenH, you must get a brake controller.  Pretty much all over the country, trailers of that weight are required to have active braking.  Check out if your car has a plug for one or whether it needs to be hand wired.  That can affect the brand that will work most easily.

As for a WDH, given the size of the car you'll be using to tow the trailer, I couldn't imagine towing without one.  It offers you greater greater safety and a much more comfortable ride.  There are numerous discussions in the archives about WDH's that you should check out.  We use a Fastway e2 hitch on with our trailer.  I got it when I bought our 172 and was towing with a Dakota that had about the same towing capacity as your car.  It has been a reliable hitch, easy to use, and provides both good sway control and weight distribution.  In a quick look at Google, it appears to be a little less costly than the Blue Ox.  I am not personally familiar with the Blue Ox, so I can't comment on it.  Check out e-trailer.com and you'll find a large variety of WDH's, any of which could meet your needs.  Good luck with your new adventure.


-------------
Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2023 at 7:12am
I have no experience with the Blue Ox. I am using an Equal-i-zer 4-point sway control hitch. 
https://www.equalizerhitch.com/ - https://www.equalizerhitch.com/
The advantage is that it has more than just the contact points on the bars to help control sway. The down side is the hitch head is heavy. I think the Blue Ox is similar. If you need something lighter, the Andersen hitch is pretty popular.
https://andersenhitches.com/product/weight-distribution-hitch/ - https://andersenhitches.com/product/weight-distribution-hitch/

The Fastway E2 is popular. It is similar to the Equal-i-zer.
https://www.fastwaytrailer.com/e2-hitch - https://www.fastwaytrailer.com/e2-hitch

Just for comparison, here is the link for the Blue Ox hitch.
https://www.blueox.com/weight-distributing-hitches/ - https://www.blueox.com/weight-distributing-hitches/

If I were going to purchase one today, I would likely go for the Andersen hitch. The main reason is the weight. The older I get the harder it is to wrangle that heavy hitch head and bars.

One other option that needs to be mentioned is electronic sway control. This is not the sway control in the TV, but one that will activate one or both of the trailer brakes to actively help counter sway. These include models from Tuson,
https://tusonrvbrakes.com/products/tuson-sway-control-tsc-1000 - https://tusonrvbrakes.com/products/tuson-sway-control-tsc-1000
Lippert,
http://www.rvupgradestore.com/Lippert-Sway-Command-Tow-Control-System-p/380605.htm - http://www.rvupgradestore.com/Lippert-Sway-Command-Tow-Control-System-p/380605.htm
And Hayes (but seems to have been discontinued, but still available),
http://highskyrvparts.com/rv-parts/rv-towing/sway-controls/hayes-brake-controller-electronic-trailer-sway-control-81775upg - http://highskyrvparts.com/rv-parts/rv-towing/sway-controls/hayes-brake-controller-electronic-trailer-sway-control-81775upg

The electronic sway controls can help in situations where the hitch sway control is unable to counter the outside forces. I think it would have helped when we encountered ice on one of our trips and ended up facing the wrong way on a bridge with a damaged TV and RPod. It happened too fast for me to think of using the manual brake control to activate the trailer brakes. The electronic ones do that much fast than you or I could so situations may not get out of hand.


-------------
StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: mjlrpod
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2023 at 9:40am
I believe you would legally be required to have a brake controller. If your camper 's GCCW is over 3000, and yours is, you must have functional trailer brakes. As far as WDH, I would seriously recommend it. I use the fastway E2 600/6000 with the square spring bars. I have transferred it to my 3rd trailer now, and it still works great. I started with a RP-172, then an RP-195, and now a surveyor 19rble. I would buy something that will be good on your "next" camper as well. 

-------------
2017.5 Rp-172
2020 R-pod 195
2015 Frontier sv 4.0L 6cyl
I'll be rpodding


Posted By: GlueGuy
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2023 at 10:43am
Yes, I agree with all the posters, you need a brake controller. There are lots of options.

As for the WDH, I would recommend one as it solves several problems with weight distribution (particularly to the front wheels). One thing that many seem to miss, a WDH will also solve the problem of having your headlights point up into the trees. We discovered this one night, when we only had a few miles to go, and I hooked up to our F150 without the WDH (to save a few minutes). To my horror, even though the towing control was fine, our headlights were pointing up in the trees. Sheesh.

So if you don't use a WDH, you most certainly will need something to correct the headlights in the form of rear suspension augmentation. The WDH method is safer.



-------------
bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost


Posted By: jato
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2023 at 5:02pm
Guess I am the odd man out here, have towed our 177 for 12+ years using the following for tow vehicles: 8 years with '08 and '13 Explorers (26,000 miles) and 4 years with '11 and '17 F-150 (17,000 miles) using a basic $ 40 Curt friction bar over all weather condition including: heavy snow and rain storms, sleet, hail, and strong 30+ mph cross winds with really no negative issues encountered.  Probably the best improvement made was on my 3rd set of tires purchased 2+ years ago going from china tires "C" load to Carlisle Radial HD "D" load tires which are much more stable and much less flex when running through adverse/strong cross winds going down the highways.

Possibly I would change my mind if I were to utilize a WDH but with all the conditions encountered thus far after 12 years and not having any problems that may be a hard sell.


-------------
God's pod
'11 model 177
'17 Ford F-150 4WD 3.5 Ecoboost
Jim and Diane by beautiful Torch Lake
"...and you will know the Truth and the Truth will set you free."


Posted By: StephenH
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2023 at 6:00pm
Jim, a lot depends on the model RPod (or other trailer). The heavier 178/179/180/190, etc. would be a different scenario than the lighter ones The heavier trailers have a correspondingly heavier tongue weight. More tongue weight, more load on the back end. Thus, while you might not need or want a WD hitch, I would not tow without it.

-------------
StephenH
Happy is the man that findeth wisdom,...

http://www.rpod-owners.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=7712 - ouR escaPOD mods
Former RPod 179
Current Cherokee Grey Wolf 24 JS


Posted By: jato
Date Posted: 23 Apr 2023 at 8:17pm
Originally posted by StephenH

Jim, a lot depends on the model RPod (or other trailer). The heavier 178/179/180/190, etc. would be a different scenario than the lighter ones The heavier trailers have a correspondingly heavier tongue weight. More tongue weight, more load on the back end. Thus, while you might not need or want a WD hitch, I would not tow without it.


That is quite understandable.  Our case is becoming more 'unique' as all the newer pods, except for the 171 fit into our scenario.  The empty weight of our 177 is a mere 2415 lbs. (no A/C, micro/convection oven or entertainment system), but fully loaded with 36 gallons water, 135 lbs/batteries and two 20# propane tanks on the a-frame and fully loaded to go for a 30 day excursion and the weight jumps to 2940 lbs. which is still probably much lighter than the bigger ones produced when they are loaded for a trip.  The 11% tongue weight (compliments of offgrid) means I need at least 323 lbs on the tongue to be safe, and we are, compliments of that battery weight - we have 340 lbs, good to go.


-------------
God's pod
'11 model 177
'17 Ford F-150 4WD 3.5 Ecoboost
Jim and Diane by beautiful Torch Lake
"...and you will know the Truth and the Truth will set you free."


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2023 at 5:54am
Carlisle load range D tires are made in China.  I have purchased several over the years and they all are stamped with their country of origin.  Load range D tires work better to dampen trailer sway, but the comfort achieved by using a WDH and keeping the trailer and TV balanced makes a tremendous difference.  If you have a vehicle with a high towing capacity so that the weight balance is not really an issue, then it's overkill.  But, when you have a vehicle that has a 5000 pound tow limit, the WHD for a typical rPod 170 series makes the cost well worth the comfort, safety, and stability you achieve.  When we towed our 172 with our Dodge Dakota it clearly needed the WHD and I am very glad we had it, especially in high cross winds.




-------------
Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: Yedmonds5
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2023 at 1:33pm
My Rpod 176 weighs 2600lbs. And my TV is rated for 5000lbs. So I will definitely be getting the brake controller, thanks to all the responses. Now I’ll have to do my research on the WDH. I don’t want to get anything that’ll tow something bigger as most likely it’ll be just me camping and I don’t see myself getting anything bigger then this Rpod.
Thanks for all the responses.


Posted By: gpokluda
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2023 at 2:23pm
Congrats on the 176. Hope you make many happy memories  with it. Glad you have settled on the need for a brake controller and WDH. My vote goes to the Fastway E2. Used that on our 179 for 10's of thousands of miles. Never felt out of control.

-------------
Gpokluda
2017 Rpod 179(sold 2023)
2022 Escape 5.0TA
2022 Ford F150 4X4 3.5EB
Triumph T120


Posted By: Ben Herman
Date Posted: 24 Apr 2023 at 9:25pm
what I would suggest doing is easing into it. Get the brake controller installed and dial it in. Take the trailer out for a trip w/o WDH (maybe a few day shakedown trip) and see how it feels to you. If it feels the least bit squirley on the highway, then consider a WDH. Alot of it depends on how far you are going and under what conditions. I use a WDH and would not travel without it (179), but might feel differently with a smaller trailer. I have a friend who tows a smaller RPod with a Tacoma without a WDH and she does fine. 


Posted By: lostagain
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2023 at 5:41am
Yedmonds5, I think the weight you are referring to is the "dry weight" specification.  It assumes a completely empty trailer with no batteries, and no LP tank, etc.  What you need to consider is the gross vehicle weight or GVWR, which is in the neighborhood of 3750 lbs. for a 176.  Trailer manufacturers play a little game in marking lightweight trailers by significantly understating the real in use weight.  By the time you add liquids, all your gear, a battery or two, and LP gas, you will be well up into the high 3K lbs. range.  

-------------
Never leave footprints behind.
Fred & Maria Kearney
Sonoma 167RB
Our Pod 172
2019 Ford F-150 4x4 2.7 EcoBoost


Posted By: GlueGuy
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2023 at 9:31am
+1 to the empty weight metric.

You will never tow that trailer at the empty weight because it will never be "empty". The best rule of thumb is to go by the gross weight of the trailer, and I'm betting that is going to be in the range of 3200 lbs (or maybe more). Further, if you "front load" your trailer (put too much stuff forward of the wheels), that will also have an outsized effect on the tongue weight.


-------------
bp
2017 R-Pod 179 Hood River
2015 Ford F150 SuperCrew 4WD 3.5L Ecoboost


Posted By: jato
Date Posted: 25 Apr 2023 at 1:09pm
+2  Your best bet, load your R-Pod as though going on a trip, don't forget to fill your FW tank with water if you travel that way.  Go to your county garage and they will weigh it for free.  Take that total weight and make sure you have 11% or more of that weight on your tongue to reduce/eliminate trailer sway.


-------------
God's pod
'11 model 177
'17 Ford F-150 4WD 3.5 Ecoboost
Jim and Diane by beautiful Torch Lake
"...and you will know the Truth and the Truth will set you free."



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