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Topic ClosedTips on Finding Hot Skin Source

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mcarter View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Tips on Finding Hot Skin Source
    Posted: 29 Jun 2020 at 8:50am
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Mike Carter
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Grant177 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Jun 2020 at 10:50am
Yes, I believe that was one of the things I tested and there was electrical connection from chassis ground to AC electrical ground.  I'll double check that when I go out again just to make sure.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2020 at 3:23pm
So, this was the next piece of the puzzle (after replacing the heating element and still not heating).




....so, after replacing that with a new one, plugging in the trailer, I was getting heat...YEAHHH!   And still no detectable trace of any power going to the chassis.

So, after getting it all back put together, I go to turn it OFF, and guess what...the AC power switch in the water heater compartment also appears to have fused now....cannot turn it off...sheesh...what next.

So, turned it off at the breaker and have to replace that next...

Whatever cooked the element appears to have done a job on the entire water heater electrical system.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Jul 2020 at 3:47pm
The element was probably run without water in the tank at some point. It then overheated and created a resistive fault to the tank (and therefore to ground. Resistive because if it was a dead short it would have tripped a breaker in the trailer panel. But the current flowing into the fault was sufficient to eventually cause the poppet thermostats and the switch to overheat. That is interesting and a bit concerning because those items should be able to handle the current flow. I'm becoming suspicious of the water heater breaker in your trailer panel. 

I would also still confirm that you have a good ground connection between the chassis and the ground pin in your power inlet. That is very important to assure safety. You don't want to be working on this stuff with the chassis hot. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Jul 2020 at 10:06pm
Hey @offgrid,

Just did another round of testing today (as I was at the trailer and replacing the AC electrical switch for the hot water heater which had fried during previous events).

I've still been unable to replicate any electrical fault since the original electrocution event and after replacing the heating element, thermostat, and switch.

Tested resistance from numerous AC electrical ground locations (ground plug on various AC plugs, inside and exterior, ground bar in fuse box, and copper ground wire coming from fuse panel.

In all locations, resistance from chassis to ground location was always under 1 ohm.  So, all I can really say is that other than blaming the camp ground voltage supply for an improper ground, my FIRST thing I'll be testing EVERY time I plug in the trailer is electricity on the chassis...

Picked up one of these to stay with the trailer at all times....


Not sure if it is just me, but also seems to be a LOT of electrocution threads here lately?

Grant
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 2020 at 7:41am
Please call is shock. Electrocution is a fatal dose of electricity (electrical execution is where it comes from). What happens to most people is being shocked, but the risk of a fatal shock under certain circumstances does exist.

When I was at Fort Hood, we had one truck and shelter in particular that was bad. At night, I could see the electricity sparking between the ladder and the ground. This is even with things being grounded with a long copper grounding rod.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 2020 at 8:12am
Originally posted by Grant177

Hey @offgrid,

Just did another round of testing today (as I was at the trailer and replacing the AC electrical switch for the hot water heater which had fried during previous events).

I've still been unable to replicate any electrical fault since the original electrocution event and after replacing the heating element, thermostat, and switch.

Tested resistance from numerous AC electrical ground locations (ground plug on various AC plugs, inside and exterior, ground bar in fuse box, and copper ground wire coming from fuse panel.

In all locations, resistance from chassis to ground location was always under 1 ohm.  So, all I can really say is that other than blaming the camp ground voltage supply for an improper ground, my FIRST thing I'll be testing EVERY time I plug in the trailer is electricity on the chassis...

Picked up one of these to stay with the trailer at all times....


Not sure if it is just me, but also seems to be a LOT of electrocution threads here lately?


Seems like an unusual number of shock issues lately to me too, but it is a small sample size. 

i ohm is good. It seems like you are probably good to go now. Use either an RV circuit analyser or as a minimum an open ground detector anywhere you plug in. I've only used the non contact testers to identify hot wires in a bundle (because you don't need direct contact through the wire insulation) but they ought to work fine to detect a hot skin condition. Note that they only detect AC voltages, so you can't use them to determine if a wire in your 12V system is hot or not. 

The remaining puzzling thing to me is why the switch and thermostat assembly in your water heater failed. In theory the breaker in the trailer panel should have prevented that. Maybe you at one point encountered a campground wiring system where either the ground or neutral was hot which might bypass the breaker entirely? 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 2020 at 3:20pm
It is not unheard of to hear of mis-wired campground pedestals. I din't think it was common, but we have mostly camped out west. I would imagine that it might be more common in places where there is a longer history, for lack of a better term. You know the place. They can't afford an actual electrician, so they give Bill--Bob a  six pack to get that pedestal wired up.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 2020 at 3:21pm
Really hard to say as this the first season we have had/used this trailer, so at any point in it's history anything could have happened....

The non-contact detector seems to work really well at detecting anything hot, so should be a good first check tool.

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jul 2020 at 4:07pm
Originally posted by GlueGuy

It is not unheard of to hear of mis-wired campground pedestals. I din't think it was common, but we have mostly camped out west. I would imagine that it might be more common in places where there is a longer history, for lack of a better term. You know the place. They can't afford an actual electrician, so they give Bill--Bob a  six pack to get that pedestal wired up.

Ummm... Do I detect just a little stereotyping of Appalachian Americans perhaps? Tongue 

I'd guess RV parks have existed in the West just as long as in the East. And I've seen some electrical work in places like Boulder Creek CA that would more than match any Eastern jury rigging. Most likely pot fueled workmanship rather than beer fueled....Star

But honestly I don't really know because i'm nearly always bonndocking.  I expect its probably safest to assume that one can run into poorly maintained campgrounds and other businesses anywhere. Trust, but verify as they say. 
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