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Topic Closedwired for solar...sorta! (MC4s on the roof)

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podwerkz View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: wired for solar...sorta! (MC4s on the roof)
    Posted: 17 Mar 2019 at 8:02pm
My new 171 has the typical sticker inside that says "Wired for Solar"

And it has the MC4's embedded in the roof. 

But there is NO 'Zamp' connector anywhere. I have traced some small black and red wires passing thru the fridge compartment and down to the trailer outside lighting harness that appear to head into the roof but I think those are for the roof spoiler lights. 

They are way too small, maybe 22 gauge, so they are not for the solar.

There is also a pair of white wires with black tracer, I followed that line back to the converter and its for the vent fan and some overhead lights inside.

Again, there is no solar connector anywhere on the sides of the pod.

I have swapped in a Battle Born lithium 100ah battery, and I plan to add a portable 100 watt panel, install my own weatherproof andersons, and add a lithium compatible Renogy controller for that, but I might want to add a small panel on the roof, since the connectors are up there. 

Does anyone know what color and gauge of wire are normally attached to those MC4s up on the roof? I assume, maybe wrongly, that somewhere, I will find two wires for connecting to my controller, but I have looked everywhere and I dont see anything.

I COULD cut all the sealant away from the MC4s on the roof, and look underneath to see what they are connected to, if anything, but then I'd have to reseal it and thats a lot of effort if someone here knows what the factory normally does.

Thanks in advance if anyone has information.






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offgrid View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 6:48am
I think the roof MC4 setup you have is made by GoPower so if no one here knows the actual wire routing I suggest you call them and ask where they would install their charge controller kit and how to hook things up. Or, miracles never cease, you might even find that someone at FR can answer your question Tongue

If that fails you can use a multimeter to trace which wire pair originates from the roof connection. You know that the wires are going to be routed to the battery somehow, so you don't need to tear into the roof connector. 

What I would suggest is to first use the voltage setting on your meter to see if there is already 12Vdc to the roof. If there is you know that those to wires are already connected to your battery. Start disconnecting wires until the 12V to the roof goes away. If nothing else is also getting disconnected at the same time then those are your two dedicated solar conductors and you can connect the solar terminals of your charge controller to them.

If you don't have 12Vdc at the roof connection point then you know the roof connection is not yet connected to the battery.  You can short the two connectors together on the roof and then use the ohms setting on your meter to see which pair of wires are coming from that point. Disconnect your battery while you're on ohms setting so you don't accidentally blow its internal fuse.  If you show very low resistance with the roof terminals shorted and infintite resistance with them disconnected then you've probably found the right pair. To confirm, remove the roof jumper, reconnect everything to the battery, and also connect the two wires you just found to the battery. Then, make sure that you get 12V to the roof with those two wires connected, and no voltage when they're disconnected, and that everything else stays connected.

And yes, 22AWG is way too small. I would hope they would use at least 14AWG for that. 

Please do let us know what you find. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 9:16am
Ours came with the zamp connector, and it was wired directly to the batteries with (I'm guessing) 6 AWG wire. So I would just check the batter/y(ies) at the front to see if there is an extra set of wires going to them. If they are those 22 AWG wires, then maybe that's it.
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podwerkz View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 11:24am
Thanks guys...I climbed up the ladder and pulled off the cap on the connectors and probed with a meter...no voltage at all, although I might run a ground wire (from the trailer chassis) up to my meter and probe again...just in case they only ran a wire to the 'hot' connector..which would be odd.

I have pulled out all the 'partitions' in the backs of all the cabinets on that side and there is nothing that appears to be cables to the MC4s. If they are there, they are buried deep.

Dang. 

OG, what you said made sense to me, because when I dropped in the Battle Born, there are 2 leads or cables on each side, positive and negative. Four cables total, 2 red, 2 black. 

I was hoping that maybe one pair was for the solar connectors and I would see battery voltage up there on the roof...but no joy in podville.

There is barely enough room up there to mount a small 50 watt panel, which would be just enough to keep the house battery happy in storage mode.

Hmmm.




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Ben Herman View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 11:31am
I would call FR or your dealer - my 179 had a two-pin plug right next to the door, down low. I use a Renogy 100w suitcase panel with built in controller. It is more than adequate to mee all of our 12v needs, even with just an ordinary 12v deep cycle battery. I added a longer (25 ft) 10 gauge cable so that I can move the panel to where the sun is.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 12:17pm
Originally posted by podwerkz

OG, what you said made sense to me, because when I dropped in the Battle Born, there are 2 leads or cables on each side, positive and negative. Four cables total, 2 red, 2 black. 

I was hoping that maybe one pair was for the solar connectors and I would see battery voltage up there on the roof...but no joy in podville.


The "zamp" port on my 2015 is directly connected to the smaller pair of battery connection cables, so i was also expecting that might be the same for yours. These look like they are about 12-14AWG btw, no way they should be 22 gauge. 

I'm also surprised that FR has gone to red and black cables. That is going to be really confusing and result in some blown fuses or worse. RV's are supposed to use the NEC wire color convention, which means that the neutral (negative) is supposed to be white. That's what mine has. 

If the roof terminals aren't connected to anything yet there is probably a place somewhere where you'll see a couple of pairs of unterminated wires where you are supposed to put the charge controller, there might be a label there as well. You might take a look around for that.  

Otherwise, I'd call FR and see what they can tell you.  You can try the dealer but they are often pretty clueless about this kind of thing. 

Good luck. 


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 1:44pm
The NEC color standards are for AC building wiring. Not necessarily correct for trailer or automotive DC wiring. It is much more common to see 12V positive to be red, and 12V negative (usually ground) to be black. But things have changed so much over the years that it is best to check to see what you have. 

When I'm working on a 12V DC circuit, I generally consider red to be positive or hot, and black to be negative or ground.

As usual, YMMV, and don't assume anything. Here is another discussion of what you might see:

bp
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podwerkz View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 2:00pm
I fired off an email to Forest River on the consumer support page. The page says to expect a response in 2-3 days...so we will see if they might be able to help.

Yeah my dealer is a decent guy, I've known them for awhile, but probably not the go-to guy for solar questions. And he is about 80 miles from me.

I'm fairly knowledgeable with solar, I've done several installs in the past, but this one 'little' issue has me stumped, and being that the unit is new to me, I'm learning as I go. There is a supicious looking 'boxed in' area in the upper cabinet behind the actual Go Power sticker, where the Furrion radio is, but I cant figure out how to get in there without just forcing the panels apart.

Yep the black and red (about 8 gauge I'm guessing) wires to the battery are red and black, and marked with little tags, 'battery positive' and 'battery negative'...no ambiguity there. Of course the house wiring is a lot of white ground wires to a ground busbar, and misc other colors on the AC side, plus romex style to the AC outlets.

Meanwhile I'm adding bubble levels, hanging pockets and little wire baskets, shelving racks, plastic totes, etc, so I'm getting misc things done. I ordered a few items for the trailer so I will be busy for a while, no real hurry on the solar install yet.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 2:00pm
It is proper practice to use NEC color code standards for RV's, because the NEC applies to RV's. Automotive does not need to (and doesn't) follow the NEC. 

But I agree, I woudn't assume anything, check everything with a voltmeter first. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Mar 2019 at 4:20pm
This is a test. Just wondering...
bp
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